Sawfish Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Platypus Wrote: > > Morality, as I understand it, involves the belief > > in something external to the human psyche. > > But requiring a human psyche to envision it, > right? > > Or are you supporting the idea that morality > exists independent of rational consciousness? I'm saying that what the human mind perceives (or imagines it perceives, or hallucinates, if you prefer) is something independent of itself, and I think, probably, superior to itself. Freud hints at this, I think, when he separates the "superego" from the "ego". The mind perceives what Freud calls the "superego" as something independent of, and higher than, what the mind perceives as the self (the "ego" or the "I"). But Freud was, I think, a materialist, so naturally he considers this perception largely delusion. What the "ego" thinks it perceives is an illusion created by another aspect of the human mind. Or so Freud would say, I think. Materialism, as I think you would agree, ultimately leads to a form of moral nihilism, where moral propositions have no real truth value. But all I am suggesting is that one can avoid moral nihilism by choosing to believe that one's moral senses reflect (however imperfectly) an external reality. Similarly, one can avoid other forms of nihilism by choosing to believe that one's physical senses reflect external reality. The nature of this external reality is another question. A Christian, and I suppose a polytheist as well, would say that it is both conscious and rational. I'm not too familiar with the eastern concept of "Karma" so I'm not sure if it is perceived as conscious or rational, but I do sort of have the impression that it is perceived as a force in the universe that is external to the self.
Source: http://www.eldritchdark.com/forum/read. ... #msg-12135
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